Sunday, August 08, 2004

Political Blaxploitation

By Seth Sandronsky

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  1. I think that Obama may prove to be better than expected.  He has a background, for example in Central America/Palestine solidarity groups.

    Posted by j cummings from  on  08/09  at  12:38 PM

  2. I applaud Seth here. Having a “background” in solidarity groups means less than zero when it comes to having to cross the necessary line that Democrats will not allow.  Obama cannot --by definition-- prove to be better than expected as anyone who crosses such a line will be marginalized...as per the entire history of the party.  Saying that Obama might prove to be better is tantamount to saying that the Democratic Party might prove to be better than expected.  At this late date, how is it possible for someone as intelligent and aware as Jordy able to say such things?  THAT’S a question everyone should ponder.  Please, Black Oxman

    Posted by Richard Oxman from  on  08/09  at  04:31 PM

  3. I am able to say such things because I separate “ought” from “is” and look at the “conjuncture.” Is having a Pro-Palestinian liberal elected at a time like this a bad thing?

    Posted by j cummings from  on  08/09  at  05:53 PM

  4. I think, judging by a recent statement even that Michael Albert is not anti-capitalist, that indeed we may want different things.  I want immediate revolution and redemption too, as I am sure you do...but I think we are at least half a century away from that, and in the mean time, to denigrate anyone who isn’t approved by RCP, etc. is to act as a monkey wrench against a maturing progressive movement.  Though I am not sure you agree, perhaps you can bring yourself to understand where I am coming from.

    Posted by j cummings from  on  08/09  at  06:02 PM

  5. Two questions:  1) From whence comes the notion that we have 50 years to play with?  2) From whence comes the comment that someone suggested that progressives must be approved by the RCP? Best, Rich

    Posted by Oxenator from  on  08/10  at  02:30 AM

  6. 50 years?  Its either that or armegeddon.  I threw the figure out it could be more or less. If you think the human race is ready for revolution on a worldwide scale right now, then do tell how and why, without many deaths...though perhaps that isn’t a problem in some schools of thought.

    My statement about the RCP was probably not appropriate, but it is interesting to see that you seem to spend much energy connecting other radicals and revolutionarires with whom you differ to liberals.  To claim that Michael Albert is not anti-capitalist is ludicrous.  In fact, I would assume quite freely that Parecon holds more anti-capitalist value than a dozen speeches by maximum leaders, outmoded centralized command economies, etc.  And I am not a huge Z freak - I think there is a lot that is flawed - particularly in the realm of privacy - to Parecon. 

    But to date, I see you spending more time on
    A) criticizing liberals, progressives and leftists who don’t meet your standards.
    B) attaching, as noted, truly principled examples of the above with unprincipledness.
    C) criticizing good ideas.
    D) aside from your stated sympathies towards ultra-left revolutionary posturing and your brilliant idea about Jay Leno (and your excellent writing,) I haven’t heard any actual ideas from you (except of course that you are “underground” and some such, as if underground activists advertise they were underground.)
    e) I say this out of profound respect for your intelligece and desire for change....the world is frustrating and we can’t have what we need immediately.  Smile.  Chavez will win on the 15th.  There is always some good news.

    Posted by j cummings from  on  08/10  at  11:27 AM

  7. Dear Jordy: To talk of decades --even from the top of your head-- is to be out of touch with the urgency I’m always underscoring.  THAT is one of most fundamental “flaws” found in the leftists that you see me repeatedly criticizing. I find it very disheartening that you talk so glibly about my self-description of “underground” activities; I run great personal risk in talking the way I do in public...and I only do that because there is no alternative...considering how little is possible without doing so. You are not showing much understanding regarding what I am trying to do, what I have to do, and how little I have to work with within the progressive community. Your continued focus of the differences between Michael Albert and the RCP is irrelevant. I don’t understand why you can’t see that I’ve only invoked each of them to make particular points.  To give only two specifics, Uncle Albert was brought up as an example of someone who is too locked into electoral politics and “making nice” among people on his side of the fence (at the expense of dealing with the urgency called for); the degree to which he is against capitalism has never been an issue with me...except peripherally.  With Avakian’s crowd, I keep communicating to you that no one has been advocating adopting the whole kit and kaboodle; rather, I have been highlighting aspects of what that corner has to offer --not the least of which is total disenchantment with electorics-- for the disgruntled.  I really would like you to get off the business that suggests that I’m shooting for premature revolution.  To wit, if you don’t think our house is on fire then that’s the beginning and end of it for the purposes of my attempt to include you in some action that will “introduce” information to the masses...with the idea of moving change along “as expeditiously as possible.” I have never written a word that suggests I am either oblivious to the potential for bloodshed or --as per my criticism of Goff playing Miss Jean Brodie to youngsters-- that I take talk about such things lightly.  If you think the Leno idea is “brilliant” then jump on that and connect those you know with me ASAP.  If you think people on the Left should be left alone to drag their heels and drag us all down in the politically correct process...then you’re probably not meant to get involved with such things as the Leno idea...which is energized by a desire to make a difference...not make more talk and reading only...in the context of an imaginary time frame.  Best, Oxie

    Posted by Not saluting Ox from  on  08/10  at  12:13 PM

  8. President Bush and Sen. John Kerry, his presidential rival, have traded barbs over the Labor Department’s July report.  Meanwhile that month, “the situation for black teens worsened with the unemployment rate jumping 4.4 percentage points to 37.0 percent” [Jobs Byte by Dean Baker (http://www.cepr.net/dbbio.htm), the Co-Director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research, August 6, 2004].  The national rate of joblessness was 5.5 percent in July. 

    Such abuse of black youth is an institutional feature of late capitalism, U.S.-style.  The GOP voices the “hard” approach.  The DP prefers the “soft” road.  The cooperation of both parties is key to the growth of income and wealth inequality, and the penitentiary for its black and brown victims in the Land of Freedom. 

    Seth

    Posted by Seth Sandronsky from  on  08/10  at  12:23 PM

  9. In addition to my comment in #7 above a few minutes ago, I’d like to know from Jordy what good ideas of criticized without cause or justification.  Also, I’d like an example of what’s meant under B...and I’d like to know why it’s so hard to understand that the bulk of what I have to offer by way of “plans” can only be put forth in confidence on a case by case basis...not in public.  I should think this latter point of mine is easy to follow...as it follows your own point, Jordy, respecting the need for “underground” activity to be truly underground.  Please...hold back from telling me to smile about advances regarding Chavez --which I am well-informed about-- as if my “problem” is that I don’t smile enough.  In taking personal risks to come above ground on this or that point to get something started THAT CAN BE TALKED ABOUT...if you can’t join hands with me in a more meaningful way...please give the state of the world the respect it deserves.  If some are not smiling as much as you would have them smile --as you interpret their words, not see their faces-- perhaps the “fault” lies in the fact that others are smiling too much...as if the house isn’t REALLY on fire.  To be very specific and brutally honest, Jordy, it is very hard to come away from the information that’s been public for so long...to come away from the sights that pass us by each day...without seeing that there is nothing like “four more years” of any administration that can be talked about...on a socially active level.  On a religious/eternal level...that’s something else.  But...in the here and now that activists suggest is their life...the “holding pattern” that is supported by most “progressives” cannot be tolerated. I suggest that you stop looking at me as someone who is advocating revolution in the usual sense, and, perhaps, begin to view me as someone who believes the entire structure of this civilization must be opposed...whether or not there is a “plan” to proceed with...whether or not it leads to this or that in one’s mind.  That’s what rotten to the core means.  That’s also what FAITH means.  Faithfully, Richard

    Posted by Faithful Ox from  on  08/10  at  12:27 PM

  10. An additional set of remarks related to #7 and #9 above --so crucial, in my estimation, to the understanding of what I’m trying to do (for the general reader here)-- I will add to the commentary under my Pilger/Zinn piece.  They are related to what’s above, but, hopefully, shed additional light from a slightly different angle.
    Blessings, Richard

    Posted by Richard from  on  08/10  at  03:44 PM

  11. I don’t oppose civilization itself.  I oppose capitalism, not libraries.  Imperialism, not arts.  Western hegemony, not Western reason.

    I do see the urgency, but that doesn’t mean that I also don’t see other possibilites.  Reminds me of Fellini’s “Orchestra Rehearsal.” it can go any way at this point.  An intelligent guy like you who has taught, etc. knows that it isn’t more urgent now than it was ten years or one hundred years ago.  It has always been this urgent.

    The global sense of urgency is actually a sign of hope.  And you don’t seem to smile often, unless of course your agit-prop is tongue in cheek, which I am starting to doubt.

    Posted by j cummings from  on  08/10  at  05:08 PM

  12. I support Barack Obama.  He’s black--he has to talk this way to get elected.  However, I think his line about black kids with books “acting white” was completely unacceptable.  There are limits to how much centrist/right-wing posturing I will take, and that goes over the line.  Truth be told though, he doesn’t really think this way.  I talked about this in Dissident Voice a few days ago:

    http://www.dissidentvoice.org/Aug04/Felux0802.htm

    I usually don’t care about these kinds of things but I think having a black person in the Senate, especially one who is relatively much better than the status quo, is a goal worth supporting.

    And Henry Louis Gates is a moron.

    Posted by Justin Felux from San Antonio, TX  on  08/10  at  06:51 PM

  13. How about an Afro-American playing the banjo...being shuffled off to Buffalo?  Seriously, Justin, I don’t want to be disrespectful...especially after I just got finished pleading for respect for myself...asking another contributor NOT to play “cute” with me.  However, I really would like to know how the Senate warrants such respect...following their track record?  Why is it not possible that it’s a Scam in your brain?  And...if it’s not...what would they have to do --that honorable body of disingenuous souls-- to convince you that they are scamming us...the vast VAST majority of them?  Is it that you don’t see an alternative?  And, if so, aren’t you interested --all else being equal-- in going back and forth with others who do have alternatives to propose?  Readers...one and all...don’t put this all on me, please.  It is our mutual responsibility to come up with other roads...to travel down...or up.  UppityOxman

    Posted by Uppity Oxman from  on  08/10  at  09:27 PM

  14. There’s no common ground respecting social activism with Jordy for me...now that we have the comment that there’s no more “urgency” today than there was ten or one hundred years ago. I’d like to know if any other readers feel the way Jordy does about that fundamental issue/question. There’s no basis for discussion...if you do...unless you’re willing to respond point for point on ALL of the bases for someone taking the stance that there is INDEED much more urgency today...in terms of the planet’s very survival...if nothing else.  I can only think that none of the most crucial information that’s come down the pike at Press Action alone respecting the environmental dangers today has taken hold in Jordy.  Again, does ANYONE else out there agree with that fundamental position he’s taken?  That one point.  This is NOT a matter of this person feels this way and that person feels that way.  This is NOT an matter of subjective opinion...this business of the planet being on the edge environmentally.  Again, I am speaking solely in terms of the activist’s world...which is grounded in a certain degree of rationality...and which demands that certain definitive documentation be honored.  Best, Richard

    Posted by Richard from  on  08/11  at  12:21 AM

  15. I do agree that the problems are much more urgent today than they were ten or a hundred years ago, especially environmentally and in the population explosion.  Without exact figures at hand I would guess the world’s population was 2 maybe 3 billion a hundred years ago.  That it is six billion plus today alone makes the problems more urgent.  But I would not want to alienate Jordy to prove myself right on this point.  We on the left need to recognize that our goals and common traits are greater than our differences and build on them rather than drive wedges between.

    Posted by Tracy McLellan from  on  08/11  at  01:08 AM

  16. We do not have “common goals” if one person is saying there’s a fire enveloping the entire first three floor of a building and another is yawning as they “talk” about how it’s awful that the bathroom’s ablaze...taking no initiative to grab a bucket...and refusing to acknowledge that the Fire Department can’t be called...because they set the damn thing to go off...intentionally.  This business of not wanting to alienate anyone who writes in this quarter is as much of a liability...working against the common concerns...as what people on the Right are doing.  If you will look at my #9 comment about what’s happened to “north” on the compass (under my PLANTATION TO PENITENTIARY PAIN piece) you’ll see that it’s time to move...and risk the alienation.  Best, Ox

    Posted by Richard from  on  08/11  at  08:57 AM

  17. Thanks Tracy and Justin for making my point in a way that I sometimes cannot.....

    And I stand corrected environmentally regarding “socialism or barbarism”...though on the other hand one hundred years ago, there wasn’t as large a global proletariat....(I often think that population growth questions are Malthusian and besides the point - it is how much RESOURCES there are, not people)

    Posted by j cummings from  on  08/11  at  11:52 AM

  18. Precisely the point. Already resources - more precisely resource allocation at the present - are stretched to the limit.  A sixth of the human population exists on $1 a day or less, and haven’t access even to potable water and basic sanitary facilities; and half the six billion on the planet exist on $2.  In our country alone disparities of wealth are ridiculous.  Bill Gates alone is wealthier than the poorest 100 MILLION.  Strange it is not seen clearly and quickly that there is something grossly wrong about this picture.  Better to intuit where you don’t have to deduce said a philosopher who shall go nameless.  All it takes is a glance to realize that this earth is shuddering under the weight of 6 billion people.  And what of mid-century when it is expected we’ll have 9 billion?

    Posted by Tracy McLellan from  on  08/11  at  02:05 PM

  19. It is not a question of alienating someone “on the left” (which in many cases means the person only dislikes Bush and wants the poor to be fed more often courtesy of the government) to prove oneself “right” on a given point. It’s a matter of risking having an argument/risking alienating someone who shares (very often) superfical agreement on given issues to significantly “address” a felt difficulty...or emergency, Justin. When John Brown advanced with a handful of souls on Harper’s Ferry...he first had to alienate the Quakers...by pointing out to them that their stance that Blacks should be relocated to Africa and/or were not the equals of Whites (in many ways, inherently) IN ORDER TO TRY TO RECRUIT AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE FOR THE DANGEROUS TASKS THAT LAY AHEAD, THE WORK THAT HAD TO BE DONE...if slaves were to “have a shot” at being freed.  The big problem here, though, is that only Justin, Jordy and Trace have weighed in...among all the other readers.  There is virtually NO dialogue going on respecting this fundamental point/disagreement...and “The Left” cannot afford to move ahead...holding hands with one another...on such shakey ground, with such a soft underbelly.  Thinking Brown, Ox

    Posted by Richard M. Oxman from  on  08/11  at  05:46 PM

  20. And before I leave the subject, it’s worthwhile to note that in addition to the points made in #19 the “Underground Railroad” was talked about in public incessantly “above ground” for very practical reasons.  Harriet Tubman was no more to be criticized than I am for talking “underground” in a public forum.  As always, it is hoped that such talk will inspire others to move along similar lines...as general education takes place.  OX

    Posted by ox from  on  08/12  at  12:15 PM
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