Thursday, November 04, 2004

Kerry's Humiliating Defeat

By Justin Felux

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Posted 11/04 | Add a Comment

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  1. To underscore three points for the moment: 1) Justin’s “no tax” for anyone making under $100,000 --that type of thing-- should be on everyone’s lips routinely in general conversation, the Obama noises are no more an “act” (as per his urging to “hit” Iran)than Hillary’s distasteful noises (which we should recoil in horror from equally), and 3) I’d like to see (especially on this site) more words about what Justin touches upon in closing.  To wit, putting our resources and creative energies into something else. Regularly. ‘Cause daily talk about THAT is what’s required to get readers to invest in something like a living wage campaign, AND...other paradigms for change.

    Posted by Richard Oxman from  on  11/04  at  09:57 AM

  2. Tom Frank is exactly what I was thinking when I heard about the poorer the country, the most likely it went Republican…

    Posted by j cummings from  on  11/04  at  10:41 AM

  3. A fantastic article. And I agree strongly with Richard’s 3 points. Especially on Obama.

    Posted by Greg from Minneapolis, MN  on  11/04  at  11:34 AM

  4. Blessings to you, Greg. And, as per a recent piece by Justin Podur (who does much more than merely talk...on the front lines...risking his life daily), I’d like to underscore that NOW the American public --contrary to what Michael Albert would have you believe-- has spoken.  They are for --for one reason or another-- all the abominations here and abroad.  Again, it is time to DO something about all of this instead of suggesting that reforms will work...down the line.  Instead of pretending --for one reason or another-- that we don’t smell the gas coming over the barbed wire fences and walls which are going up fast.  Time, perhaps, to risk losing a few “friends.” Again, contact me ASAP to learn more about new paradigms for direct action. I’m hoping Mark will post a piece I have planned for this site shortly on specific action you can take...without me, if you like.

    Posted by Richard Oxman from  on  11/04  at  12:16 PM

  5. For once I agree with Richard on how the vast majority of people in the United States are, more or less, in favor of U.S. domination of the world in the form of the “war on terror.”

    I suspect that most of those who say they do not believe that the U.S. should have invaded Iraq only feel that way because it has been “tough.” If it had been a cakewalk (a word that I believe everyone uses in their life more times than they have actually participated in such events) it would be all cheers.

    Posted by micah holmquist from  on  11/04  at  12:43 PM

  6. Yes,but don’t you all think too that people are “for the war"(and the rest of the neocon con job)because they have been systematically fed oceans of lies,layer upon layer?As dumb as Bushie likes to appear(and truly,I doubt he’s a genius or anything),the people behind the curtain are not stupid.Even a cursory look-see at the PNAC website reveals in part at least,what these folks have in mind.

    There’s a sickness in this country,an epidemic really,and the Bush campaign has just been more blatant at exploiting it than the ones before it.They’ve used some pretty clever psychological ploys on the country,using fear as a wedge.Fear of terrorism,fear of gays(because you let gays get married and “real"marriage is in danger.How,I have no idea,I have yet to hear one valid point that works on that one),fear of anyone not white(unless they’ve been whitened up and meet approval,ala Condie Rice,who makes me cringe),fear of the poor,fear of losing jobs,and that’s the short list.In short,if it’s not white suburbia or white wealth then it’s a problem.So,the goal is to make the whole world the same,I’ve heard it called McDonaldization,on a global level.

    What we have is an uninformed public basing decisions on"moral"values.This makes me so angry,holding Bush up as some sort of moral standard.His Texas Rangers deal,Arbusto/Harken scamery,none of that is common knowledge amongst his supporters.This is seriously like what happens to people who join cults,even when given actual irrefutable proof,they don’t believe it.How do you deprogram that many people?I don’t think it’s possible.America has spoken,but it’s a Brainwashed America.

    Posted by Tammy from Metro Atlanta  on  11/04  at  02:30 PM

  7. This may be mere talk, but I think Tammy has a point…

    The American public has spoken? The American public supports abominations here and abroad?

    There are about 295 million Americans accounted for in the census. Of that
    number, a little under 200 million are eligible to vote.

    Roughly 115 million voted on Nov. 2.

    59 million or so for Bush (no figures on how many many of them were voting “against Kerry” more than “for Bush").

    59 million out of 295 million is 20%. Even if you factor out those under a given age (whatever age you may choose), what is it? 30%?

    Tough to make such grand declarations based on 20-30%.

    This isn’t to say the American public (all of us included) is not guilty by association at the very least...but we can’t ignore the above numbers if we want to move forward.

    Posted by Mickey Z. from  on  11/04  at  02:49 PM

  8. Forgot to say thanks to Justin for using my quote.

    Posted by Mickey Z. from  on  11/04  at  02:55 PM

  9. Unfortunately, I think we are going to possible see an Obama/Clinton ticket against Arnie/Rudy—Arnie was not born here, you say? Just wait…

    Posted by Kap Fulton from San Diego, CA  on  11/04  at  07:09 PM

  10. The American Public --including many readers and writers on this site-- have been “speaking” for a very long time with regard to abominations at home and abroad.  It, obviously, isn’t just the people who vote for Bush People...that are The Problem.  Those who detest Bush but continue to play the game of only words and activism as socializing, activism as career building, activism as psychological cushion should be as ashamed as Scott Ritter asked us to be the other day, and disgusted with themselves as Justin Podur was the other day...on his site. One should be very careful about how much print and posturing is done from now till “then” in addressing the Obama/Clinton stuff that’s headed down the pike...and all of the related material. Just like Chomsky advised us to spend five min with electorals, we sd spend 5 min burning away all those straw figures...and then burn many of the bridges we have been propping up with Chomsky-like talk. Attempts must be made to work w one and all, BUT...one is obliged to get “busy” w/o waiting much longer....

    Posted by Richard Oxman from  on  11/04  at  08:16 PM

  11. And the left did very little to help me get Bush and Cheney’s FBI files. How we could get to this point in history without leftist lawyers and groups suing to get the FBI file on Bush released is a damn shame. Who on the left, as four more years of Bush begin, will help me get the FBI file on Bush?

    Check out my blog about this issue, please.

    Posted by Michael Petrelis from  on  11/05  at  03:47 AM

  12. ROx anti tox-man, Have the American people really spoken? Is it not possible that through vote fraud/ no-paper trail computerized voting that the vote was a fraud to begin with? Of course, pointing out the false alternatives Bush and Kerry has academic meaning, but that horse has been beaten to a pulp (by myself included, I realize too late). Since the savvy Left are in agnostic denial about technically complicated topics (strategically unwise!) then they assume the official story, just as with 911 (articles now abound at pressaction and Counterpunch assuming that Kerrry lost). If the vote was a fraud to begin with, the entire debate about who to vote for was absurd and irrelevant (since it could not result in any concrete result). Admitting this though would be too inconvenient/embarrasing. In the spirit of open and vigorous debate, your’s in solidarity, always...Rhino

    Posted by Rhino Rick from  on  11/05  at  10:06 PM

  13. If Mark posts my latest article in the next few days you’ll see several sources listed that address the obvious electoral fraud...which I’m sure ALL readers are familiar with by now. Nevertheless, the people have been speaking for quite some time; the huge # of Bush groupies --whether or not they represent a literal majority of those voting-- are beside the point. My point is that the gen’l public, including Bush-haters, have been supporting US abominations...by insistence on “comfort” (in one form or another), by dependency on routine, and so on. While I have the op writing here...I’d like to mention that you can find my latest article on both Kap Fulton’s site (out of San Diego) and Micah’s site; both were sweethearts to post me...and I hope readers will delve into that piece which relates to what we’re talking about here and beyond. My very latest article --which is even more directly related to the subject at hand-- should see the light of day this weekend...or by Monday...somewhere.  Love, Richard

    Posted by Richard Oxman from  on  11/06  at  01:51 AM

  14. OK, glad I’m being paranoid about people accepting the official vote count. If Commondreams is covering it than it must be well known.

    We agree on the general point (and most every other point when assumptions are clarified): the general public support the US empire. Whether they really SUPPORT it or just support it is another matter, manufactured consent and all. As for the level of denial on the part of Bush haters, it is astounding. The other day someone told me they knew the Dems were the flip side of the same corrupt coin, but would stick with them til a viable third party emerged. What this chap failed to grasp was that THAT WON’T HAPPEN UNTIL THE ABBers et al., MAKE IT HAPPEN.
    Look forward to your next article ROx and roll man.

    Posted by Rhino Rick from  on  11/06  at  02:44 AM

  15. M is for murder. Thanks to the heavens, Rhino.  Your “Whether they really SUPPORT it or just support it is another matter, manufactured consent and all.” is something that ALL readers sd be debating here incessantly..for the next five minutes! To wit, this comment deserves to be tossed over and over IMMEDIATELY...IN TERMS OF OUR VICTIMS.  Whether it’s with a capital S or the lower case variety...the genocide, for one, is ALL THE SAME. I truly appreciate that you’re in there swinging w both fists, Rhino. At least you’re trying to address this Mess with a capital M.

    Posted by Richard Oxman from  on  11/06  at  10:04 AM

  16. It has been said(by whom I am not sure at the moment),that a measure of a culture/civilized nation is in how they treat not only others,but their own.This massive across the board cultural denial of what eurocentric culture has wrought is the heart of ALL the problems in this country and abroad.Admitting the system is beyond repair of any sort,letting it go and properly trouncing and eliminating it scares the crap out of people because they will have to give up those comforts they feel entitled to have.After all they work hard for what they have(or in the case of most of the “elite"steal),so having a Hummer or SUV is a right.(using the vehicles as merely a symptom of the illness)Entitlement.

    While I do believe those passionate about changing the face of politics have good intentions(and I do believe also that indeed the road to hell is paved quite nicely with them)they refuse to see that this is not about voter rights and reform,campaign budget reform,prison reform,education reform and so on.It is about abolishing a system that was doomed to fail from the beginning because it ignores anything BUT a eurocentric world view.To say that aloud is unamerican,unpatriotic,treason even.

    We are a nation of short attention spanned and distracted people.We focus on surface issues,rarely getting at the root of where they came from.We are depressed,angry,stressed,rushed,neglectful and are locked into a desparate need to fill the voids or medicate(by means not exclusive to pharmacutecals)so we can’t feel and focus on how we ended up in the Mess.

    Not too long ago I read The Culture of Make Believe by Derrick Jensen.As I read,I not only wept and became physically ill,I wanted to run.Interesting,my first impulse was to run,not to read on and absorb what the author was trying to say.To throw the book at the wall and dismiss it as"too radical”.I forced myself to read on anyway.It exploded everything I was ever taught about “morals"and “values”.It might behoove many who hold the notion of “America"too closely and too dearly to take some time with this work,absorb it,and then decide if the current way of doing things still holds merit.

    Posted by Tammy from Metro Atlanta  on  11/06  at  11:51 AM

  17. Thank you Tammy for those deep thoughts about the nature of American hegemony. More people need to look into their hearts and see that they enemy is thyself. For my ABB friends to deny the massive empirical evidence against Kerry, and then to say they want a third party but will do nothing to create it, well, I don’t know what to say.

    To ROxy Muzik anti-toxin man, people have been acknowledging the stolen election. Kim does so in the first paragraph of her article on progressives moving to Canada, and Cockburn mentions it as part of his powerful rant that that exposes Kerry’s horrific voting record (and I think we can once and for all forget about Michael McMoore having any credibility). BTW: why was this voting record not spread far and wide BEFORE the “election” (fraud) by his supporters? I can recall early on speficically emailing the Kerry website for his voting record after they had solicited me. There was no substantive response! Obvious frauds.

    Also, yes, the main issues should be how we can stop the global monetocracy from carrying out its agenda (and Tammy might read Derrick’s newest book, Welcome to the Machine, to grasp this further) of global genocide/ecocide/ominicide. Tammy, see also Gaian Democracies by Madron and Jopling. It is one of the Schumacher series.

    There are victories by the way. Indigenous peoples throughout the world are employing a variety of tactics and sometimes stalling off the resource plunderers. See The Ecologist magazine as a good source. Also, Cultural Survival has a great magazine on this topic. A way to get involved by letter writing is through a group called Global Response.org. These are bandaid solutions but the best I can come up with at the moment.

    Posted by Rhino Rick from  on  11/06  at  07:24 PM
    18. Commenting is not available in this weblog entry. {/if}

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